By Arslan Saidov

On ‘Time of Freedom’ (program hosted by Arslan Saidov with the participation of Alexander Cherkasov from the ‘Memorial’ human rights center.)

ALEXANDER CHERKASOV: You know, our jurist colleagues haven’t yet stated their opinion; they’re still forming it. There were two days of hearings where tens of representatives spoke, tens of experts, tens of witnesses, tens of victims from various places and times, in the North Caucasus and from terrorist acts in Beslan, Moscow, and at ‘Nord-Ost’. The experts spoke. Today the jurists are getting ready to meet with representatives of the official structures. It’s another matter that, officially, Russia doesn’t wish even the government’s opinion to be heard by the leading jurists. Of the many agencies meeting with them, only representatives of the justice ministry and Ella Pamfilova, Vladimir Lukin, and representatives of the Federal Council and parliament will speak. A majority of the ministers and agencies, active or sometimes active in the struggle against terrorism, preferred not to state their opinion. Apparently they don’t wish to be heard, or they could care less about the opinion of world human rights groups.

ARSLAN SAIDOV: Alexander, to what do you relate these difficulties that have turned up in the work of the commission of prominent jurists?

ALEXANDER CHERKASOV: Likely it’s that Russia doesn’t wish to use the experience of others. There’s the path of wisdom, there’s the path of imitation, and there’s the path of one’s own experience, which is the most difficult. Apparently one’s own experience, the most difficult path, is the one we want. What has happened here since 1999, in these so-called counter-terrorism operations, is far from a local phenomenon. One can follow the experience of Latin America, Asia, the US, and Great Britain too see the struggle against terrorists and its effect on all of political life and the human rights system in a country. Worldwide experience, perhaps, is worth learning, it’s useful for Russia to not repeat the mistakes of others. However, it’s likely that our generals and officials want to keep for themselves this privilege, to repeat over and over the mistakes made in other places and at other times.

ARSLAN SAIDOV: Alexander, you personally represent the Russian human rights organization ‘Memorial’. Have you noted any trends in your work? Are you concerned that ‘Memorial’ could be forced to cease its activities?

ALEXANDER CHERKASOV: You know, this has been affecting us for many years already. One of the most visible Russia human rights advocates five years ago said that it was all over, and that all who were working in Russia were merely pretending and covering for the unattractive face of our authorities. If we look at the last few years, we see that these have been years of work, and even successes. We’ve really been able to protect people, sometimes in Russian courts, and sometimes at the Strasbourg court. Sometimes we’ve succeeded, even under today’s conditions, and we’ve managed to get the government to accept changes, after, of course, a long period of it ignoring the human rights advocates. Russia’s not going anywhere, and we, as citizens of Russia, aren’t going anywhere either, and so we have to protect our rights. We must draw attention most of all to our authorities, and attention to our fellow citizens. Where else to we have to go? How can this work come to an end? It’ll continue even during even more difficult years. I’ll remind you, for example, of the so-called political Red Cross that was working in the Soviet Union until 1938.

ARSLAN SAIDOV: It’s no secret that, in your activities with the experts, with the commission of prominent jurists, you’ve analyzed the situation in Chechnya. What conclusions did you reach?

ALEXANDER CHERKASOV: Our conclusions, these are our conclusions and we repeat them regularly, and not just about Chechnya, but the entire North Caucasus. Perhaps our main conclusion is that the practice of this so-called counter-terrorism, which often covers up governmental terrorism, is counterproductive. Such activities can only lead to the formation and strengthening of the mobilized base of terrorists. The government doesn’t need it, because it just increases over and over the number of its enemies. The government does not need it, but perhaps it’s needed by specific politicians in order to strengthen their position, to increase their power.

The fact is, yes, that in Chechnya the intensity of the conflict is decreasing, one can’t help but acknowledge this. But the conflict now has spread over the entire North Caucasus. For example, if we look at kidnapping statistics for the last year, the number of violent crimes of this nature in Ingushetia is half as many as in Chechnya, but Ingushetia leads in murders, civilian murders, by three times as many as in Chechnya. So the conflict in Chechnya maybe quieting down step-by-step, but it’s spreading over the entire North Caucasus. Even in those regions that before were peaceful, like Kabardino-Balkaria for example, their own terrorist underground has appeared. So the solution to the problem at times becomes more difficult than the problem itself, or in other words, the cure is worse than the disease.

ARSLAN SAIDOV: Alexander, you are nonetheless in agreement with Mary Robinson’s opinion, which she stated in an interview on ‘Die Deutsche Welle’, that the terrorist threat is now advantageous to the leadership of Russia?

ALEXANDER CHERKASOV: It’s likely that Mary Robinson said this considering the last days of the hearings. Yes, the Russian leadership, since the fall of 1999, has used the terrorist threat from the very beginning, at first in order to come to power. Putin, excuse me, got his greatest ratings from his counter-terrorism rhetoric in the fall of 1999. Later, after ‘Nord-Ost’ and Beslan, these events were used to attack the press and to shut down the parliamentary and party systems in Russia.

ARSLAN SAIDOV: So, Alexander, your opinions coincide. Thank you.

Comments (2)

1. Террористическая угроза выгодна руководс Written by Николай , on 11-05-2007 19:38 «…Путин, извините, создал свой огромный рейтинг именно на контртеррористической риторике осенью 1999 года…»… Это еще хорошо, если он только воспользовался ситуацией… http://zhurnal.lib.ru/s/sudenko_n_n/prostite.shtml Report

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